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thursday april 20, 2006 : special feature

story links: interview with dave winer

extended interview: on the future of advertising (mov|wmv), on the history of the personal computer (mov|wmv), on the holiday season (mov|wmv), on habits online (mov|wmv), on the ownership of rss (mov|wmv), on writing style (mov|wmv)

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April 20, 2006 • 7:35 am | Permalink

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  • SteveL says:

    Dave's down to earth way of explaining ethics, experimentation, and being able to create something people will enjoy using the tools that you have available, made this my favorite RB interview..ever. Thank's for this one. And thank you Dave.

  • looking what was in the links before reading of winer and the interviews, i thought you had won awards in all those subjects ahaha omg this is the rb influence on me ;)(only for amanda) :) :p :-x (only for amanda)

  • En Why See says:

    great! passed it on to my Columbia J-School peeps.

    See you tonight!

  • Amanda..."No commercials in five years"...Should you be listening to this guy? He has no grasp on reality.

  • james ryan says:

    Nice day to be outside in New York City. Loved the children playing and the flowers blooming.

  • Noam Samuel says:

    I don't think we'll see the complete death of ads simply because many websites have to pay the bills. I do, however, see the ads (already) moving in the direction of personalized, unintrusive ads, kind of like adsense.

    I believe that most people today (With the possible exception of a few Philips execs) understand that ads work best if you want them. Therefore, the big buck is in making people want to look at (and click on) the ads.

  • B-man 2.0 says:

    Amanda: Dave thanks for having me...
    (....boy that can be interpreted in many vloggy ways)

    Winer: ....we need them to have the pressure to feel creative (TOTALLY Agree!!!)

    Winer: amateur who does it for love is an amateur...the amateurs have the integrity over the professionals....

    What a CROC!!!!! Most of the VLOGS / BLOGS I've seen spew utter stupidity. The professionals did a great job on Dumbing Down America. The majority of vlogs & blogs have continued along this path .... of course there are exceptions like RB but I'd say from my own experience about 10% (being generous) have something CREATIVE & INTERESTING to offer.

    Seeing a cat in a bra isn't enlightening if you know what I mean. Great to look at once...

    Winer: writers who work for others have less integrity to offer than those who do it for love.

    AGAIN a complete generalization and a misuse of the word INTEGRITY. One is integrous to oneself. You can be the best you can be in any situation. It's a choice one makes to be Truthful, paycheck or no paycheck. So Winer's statement is off base... again.

    The problem with todays' media is that there is no integrity and vloggers and bloggers have learnt some pretty poor habits...

    Winer; every kid should have basic journalism skills (I AGREE, BUT THAT DOES NOT MAKE THEM INTEGROUS...just look at the leading newspapers across the country and the comments posted by bloggers and vloggers...)

    INTEGRITY is the key word. BS is BS whether on a blog or in mainstream media.

    Interesting interview.

  • cris10 says:

    Hi Amanda- good interview. Interesting- so much, in fact that I clicked on the extended version on the future of advertising. After that, however, I do not feel compelled to hear Mr. Winer's views on much else. It's clear he doesn't know much about advertising, so I really don't understand what possesed him to continue talking about it.

  • Gary says:

    Writers who work for pay have less integrity? That makes it sound as if the issue is with the writers when its really the fault of their employers: threatening dismissal for demonstrating integrity is evidence of a failure of managagerial ethics, not a fault of those employed (didn't there used to be a Constitutional ammendment making that sort of thing illegal?)

  • TD says:

    Re: Advertising

    I totally agree with Weiner that putting the adds separate is a good idea. As he says, people will watch the adds to find out what kind of kooky creative things you come up with for it, or because their interested in the product. Additionally, you would be able to let potential advertisers know how many times your adds get viewed, whereas you can't know if they're viewing them at the end of Rocketboom.

  • musicfan says:

    On the future of adverstising
    43.3333333 hours of viewing per year to 20% of mover and shakers in new media is power changing the world. Who cares about advertisements you guys are changing lives. :-)
    Thank You

  • tycobrahe says:

    Like the trademark map, Thursday on a park bench being interviewed by Amanda should be another RB touchpoint. Sort of the Amanda version of being on the couch with Oprah. (at least for the Summer)

  • mr. m says:

    Great interview. I really wish you'd have more extended interviews in the future, but next time, include them in the podcast.

  • Philipp says:

    More of that please!

  • Joe C says:

    One of the best RBs ever. Absolutely top-notch, Manda.

    For me, this episode represents what's so great about the freespace of non-commercial vlog/blogs.

    It's what RB and DriveTime and others are all about. Nice, intelligent people actually talking and reasoning with one another instead of shouting their agenda slogans. It's so wonderfully refreshing. I'm so starved for real conversation instead of someone who's always "on message". In a way, it's like when I was a kid and we played baseball with no "organization", no adults, just us having fun.

    Amanda, don't ever lose that honesty. You're doing great things.

    -Joe C.

  • Eryckx says:

    Great interview Amanda.
    Just came across your site and I Love it.
    Keep up the good work.

  • En Why See says:

    Great event at the Pioneer Theater 2nite! Please plan more of these, if you can, so more of us 'boomers can be there.

    P.S. Don't forget to put the first show up, puhleeze!

    Jeff

  • RF says:

    Amanda- Now this is what you do best. The Interview with Dave was excellent and sopisicated. However, you have to think though if you get your way in supporting Ben for congress it will destroy the inovation that Dave is trying to do. You see if Ben gets in to congress he will look at the dot-com crowd innovators as rich and therefore will tax them to the hilt. Therefore even with the ways Dave was saying that you change advertising Rocketboom viewers may be stuck with more ads while waiting to see the quality programing we just saw today.

    If Ben gets in there he will be a member of a political party that supported the Microsoft Anti-Trust suit. No matter what you think of Microsoft and wether they have a monopoly or not. One fact is true that suit was a contributing factor to the dot-com crash of the 90's

    Not only that Ben most likely will adopt a John Kerry post-modern form of foreign policy that will support policies which could take away current US Control of internet domains which promote free speech and give it away to an international body where nations that have a vested interest in totalitarism will stifle the free expression going on there now. Do we want to do that? NO.

    Ben will also support McCain-Feingold which restricts the rights of bloggers to support the candidates they want to such as if they want to wear a T-Shirt supporting that candidate in a video blog. The Current law basically states that that is a campaign commerical. In other words you have to put in to your blog if you want to do that the stupid words of a voice over from ben saying "I am Ben... and I approved this message" I think McCain-Feingold is a horrible law. Ammanda you should rail against this law as so many bloggers left and right are complaining about and I would support you so could wear what ever t-shirt you want. But Ben I am sure is a big believer in McCain-Feingold and if he gets his way his party's belief in campaign finance would strangle the blogosphere they claim to be allied with.

    What I am saying is that you did a fantastic interview today with a man who is great invovations and making our lives better. However, your political perceptions of the world are going to stifle the very great things he was talking about.

  • ballgame says:

    RF, it is precisely the encroachment of mega-corporations which poses the gravest risk to our freedoms and democracy. These giant corporations only foster innovation when it suits them (i.e. when they control it), and don't hesitate to use their bloated political and economic power to swat it down when it threatens their pre-eminence. The failure to halt such a blatant monopoly power as Microsoft only appears to be a 'minor' issue when compared to the grave misjudgements and stunning ineptitude of this administration, as demonstrated by its tragicomic foreign policy and its mind-numbingly hypocritical and corrupt tax policies.

    But, ahem, nice show, Amanda! I think Winer had a good point about amateur enterprises potentially being able to embody a higher level of integrity than professional ones.

  • RF says:

    ballgame: I appreciate your comment but it is the market itself not the government that is breaking the hold that Windows has on software. It wasn't the government that developed Linix or Red Hat. You have a choice if you want to run your computer on a different platform. What we don't want is Washington setting and targetting achievement. Because at the same time the suit on Windows was going on Intel was a huge player and they still are and yet no one went after them. And no one should because you can run your computer on an AMD chip.

    Corporations by and large make our lives better. Because what they do is allow someone to take a risk and make product. Remember all of what you see in Redmond Washington today came out of Bill Gates's garage. Love or hate him his products have made the modern day internet possible. We live in a better world because of him. Now if you don't like his products the market has come up with a solution.

    The market is what does this it is flexible and elastic. Government can't move on this paradigm. It is the thing makes us unique in the world. Monopolies don't last forever. In 1970's Ayn Rand appeared on Phil Donhue and someone was complaining about the Arabs and Oil Prices and this lady was worried that the arabs were cornering the market. Well 1980's hit and oil prices dropped. Well times are different with a little more demmand these days but there is not going to be a monopoly in oil. Even the arabs say they can't control prices anymore even though they would like bring prices down because it kills off the gander that the goose needs. Something to think about....

  • ballgame says:

    RF: Free markets are wondrous vehicles for bringing certain kinds of products into being and distributing them. However, a truly free market is characterized by many buyers and many sellers. It strains credulity to assert that the computer industry is a free market when vast portions of that market lie in the looming shadow of the Microsoft juggernaut. You may say that Linux is making inroads, but I'm not going to hold my breath waiting for MS's market share to drop below 50%. (Is it under 90% yet?)

    While it may be true that I or my company can choose what PCs or OSs to buy, I cannot choose what landscape they will function in, and if that landscape is dominated by a single supplier's products, the cost/benefits analysis of my decision will invariably be tilted in favor of that supplier's products. (And BTW, I thought Windows came out of Xerox's garage (via Apple)).

    It's interesting to me that you also raise the subject of the oil industry. Microsoft kept its prices artificially low in its early years to capture the market and propel its leap into monopoly status. Similarly, gasoline prices in the U.S. have been artificially low (compare to Europe or to the true cost of aquiring and protecting oil), and our economy is now dangerously -- perhaps irretrievably -- addicted to a substance which will soon disappear: cheap oil. (Oil will still be around for a while. It just won't be cheap.) The economic consequences of the disappearance of cheap oil will be potentially devestating for the U.S. (See James Kunstler's Clusterfuck Nation Chronicle at www.kunstler.com for much more compelling arguments about what looms on the horizon.)

    Of course, even if dire circumstances come to pass, some will still argue that 'markets are working'. Markets always work ... as long as you don't look too closely at what happens to the human meat which is one of its constituent products.

    Oh, hi Amanda! Don't mind us! ;)

    Anyway, I enjoyed crossing swords w/you, RF.

  • Dave Winer is a sage. There is no better way to say it.
    The people aguing that most blogs are pure B/s are forgetting or have never gotten the point. Blogging is not about reaching the masses, it's about personal stories and people. Bloggers are indeed amateurs who do what they do for love of blogging and the community of bloggers.

    The phrase that writers who get paid lose part of their integrity is a simi plausible term.
    As a writer you are forced to give up on certain parts of your material an ad other material where it's needed in order to reach the masses. So yes it's true, that writers do in fact give up on part of their integrity.
    But the large industry of publishers and writers do what they do because the market want's it. If people stopped to buy the books of authors then you could have a point. But there has to be perks of being a skilled writer, such as a decent income. Why should the world suffer from the loss of great authors because they demand money for their services. If they didn't then we would be deprived of much beauty.

    I remember a phrase, don't ask me from where but it says "you can allways trust a liar to lie". That's what i love about blogging: that you allways know what people stand for because they refuse to be afraid to show their political affiliation. Mainstream media constently manipulates, through content control.

    With rocketboom i know that i have amanda and andrews oppinions,

    Ps. forget i ever wrote this. it's the worst rant ever

  • RF says:

    Ballgame-
    Who knows Microsoft may never get under 90% of the operating system market. Whoever said though we need an operating system? Google seems to be working on their own system that could replace windows. Untill then I am a windows guy for the reasons expressed in this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xqp9zPI0-9M

    You are perceptive to note that I mentioned oil. I picked it because it is the one thing that people think there is no other option but there is. The momment that oil hits a certain price tar oil in Canda all of the sudden becomes much cheaper to drill. Not only that Hydrogen looms on the horizon which can be done with $300 to $400 changes to an existing car and that is limitless. Once we do that the Saudis become a sand heap. E-85 from Iowa corn looms out there which can stretch out our supply. But oil may never be cheap as you said but it doesn't mean that the current paradigm will always be so I am optimistic about the future. Thanks for your reply.

  • I see Dave excited all the want to be novelist...cheez...shorten them up a little.

  • Doot says:

    I would have ask Mr. Winer why the bloggers, if so great and unbiased, lost to mainstream media with regards to the Iraq war and the Bush re-election.

  • WildFiction says:

    I haven't been able to find the Doc Cyril's or Memorandum (sp?) blogs. Anybody have links for me?

  • obo says:

    Geez, Dave, journalism doesn't pay _my_ bills. My day job at Taco Bell does that, because at least it pays $9 an hour.

    ~obo

  • Smithie Boho says:

    Dave you Deadhead~!

  • kemosabe says:

    I'm looking for Doc's URLs website too, wildFiction. Anyone else know?

  • kemosabe says:

    I'm looking for Doc's URLs website too, wildFiction. Anyone else know?

  • Dekita says:

    Doc Searls Weblog

    Memeorandum


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